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Our Ending Days Chapter One

 
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hboff
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:05 am    Post subject: Our Ending Days Chapter One Reply with quote

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Our Ending Days Chapter One
Posted by Cpt Crapper (aznintegra023@yahoo.com)
28 January 2005, 4:26 AM

http://halosn.bungie.org/fanfic/?story=cpt_crapper.0128050426171.html
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sam_fisha
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need to paragraph.
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MasterSushi
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need to paragraph better.
[indent]Blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy.
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy.
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy.

[indent]"Oh my freaking gawd!"blahdyblahdyblahdy
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy.

[indent]Blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy
blahdyAs you can guess. I am rubbish at writing
examples. Blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy
blahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdyblahdy.

Just paragrpah like that and it'll be good. I just glanced at the story but I'll read it over now.
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HoZ
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

got... headache....

^
||
||
||
im with Stupid
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Azrael
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paragraphing, yes, but on to other things.

There were minor problems with grammar and some spelling errors, but nothing glaring. Proof-read it once more before you send it off next time. If you're going to write someone's thoughts, use italics. You used it once in your story, so I know you know how to use code. Good. Anyone's thoughts should be put in italics.

Obviously I don't know how the story is going to specifically progress, but you may be digging your own grave right off the bat. There are a ton of characters here, and putting them all in one story is difficult.

Overall, I was impressed. I'll be eager to see where this goes, it's a theme that's done a lot on HBO, but good writing is always welcome. Good luck.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll agree that you could benefit from paragraphing: Get that text properly organized and separated out for us. If you don't, things may appear jumbled, and be more difficult to read. So get your thoughts structured all nice ang good. It comes across as more professional - and you should shoot for that.

Watch those sentenses. You started to get a wee bit wordy in there - and you had some run-ons. Try to avoid that. It takes away from the flow, and just is awkward to read and continue through in writing. Also, there were places where things started to get confusing; jumbled and not very coherent. Avoid that, if you can.
Proofreadin would help. If you read it to yourself [perhaps outloud] you may get a better understanding for where things sound awkward. Also, try handing it off to a friend or two. Since you wrote it, some things will be hard to see or find - you will be blinded to them substantially. You friends, on the other hand, while, hopefully, partial to you, should be able to notice these mistakes. It helps out quite a bit. I've had friends give me great pointers before - things that I would have not even considered.

Watch those PoVs, too. In just your first paragraph, you switched from third to first and then back to third again.
Now, speaking of perspectives; the character that you introduced first struck me as odd. Not necissarily the character, but the way he was thinking about the Covie attacking. I would have added just a bit about him being apprehensive and wishing that the Covenant would never attack - even though he wouldn't mind getting some kills.
And continuing on to human forces: thousands of ships? Well, I could see a heavy presence, but I doubt that the humans even have a thousand ships left at all. I could see mid-hundreds - but not over about five or six (that is a lot of ships, you know).

I thought that whole interaction between the Marine and Navy Brass was a little over-the-top. Too much yelling, and too much sounding like the UN . . . the current UN, that is. Tone that down a bit; don't take all of it out, but make it look like these are intelligent professionals.

"Delta"? Well, as far as we know (if you are refering to the Army SF), the Army does not really exist any more. We have the Navy, and the Marines. Perhaps there could be an Army - but I would stick to just local militias - if even that. Work with what you have; but, if you add a differing element, just explain it so it makes sense.
Still talking about the military: Two hours to find out that the Covies have invaded Sol is a long time. Info would get out faster than that - at least I would think so. If not, then why? A question your story should have answered.

Yes; do be careful with those characters. The more you have, the harder it gets to sucessfully and smoothly use a story to encompass them all. Things can get jerky if you just choose to switch between all of your characters during one story. Try to limit that kind of thing.

Well, the base of your plot has been done before. However, you seem to be taking it from a slightly different angle - that's good. Use something new and original, something that people will not get bored with.


Overall, this was pretty good. It could use some smoothing out; so make sure to work hard to use the advice you are given to improve your writing. Keep it up; and good luck.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm also beginning to see a trend here.

[Action: Dave leafs through yet another note-pad, tapping his chin with a pen.]

Captions for settings.

I really am beginning to wonder the morality of using captions. They should be detailed and professional, not just tell us a mindless name.

"Camp Alpha, Australia."

Okay. Where the hell is it? Australia's a really big place, we all know that. Where could Camp Alpha be? Is it in Sydney, on the street, in a burger joint, or something?

People need to learn to make implications. You need to be able to tell us without telling us. For example, if they're in a pelican, instead of saying:

"They were in a pelican. The Master Chief did this and that...."

You could let it flow into detail, like I've done.

"The open hatch let a cool breeze into the cramped interior of the dropship, the Master Chief looking out into the..."



Then again, I'll go with the Paragraphing. So many newcomers forget paragraphing. They're often the only ones who can read their story without getting lost - because it's their imagination. We can't see into your mind, so you're going to have to paint it for us.

And paint it well. We'll help you. If you have any questions, contact me, MCC, Nick Kang, or anyone else who frequents the forums.

- Dave.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave Luck wrote:
"Camp Alpha, Australia."

Okay. Where the hell is it? Australia's a really big place, we all know that. Where could Camp Alpha be? Is it in Sydney, on the street, in a burger joint, or something?


I agree. However, you don't always/necissarily have to have a heading that says "Camp Alpha, Sydney Opera House, Sydney, Australia". You could, instead, show us through explenation and description. Just give us a basic location, and then expand on it in your actual writing; whether it be through an initial explenation or through the PoV of a character you have or are introduced/ing.

I'll expand a bit on Dave's example. Instead of:
Theoretical You wrote:
They were in a Pelican. Master Chief sat stiff in his chair near the back of the Pelican. They were flying over the city. The buldings were smoking because the Covenant were attacking it. The Marines were dying and needed help down there.

Granted, I kind of dropped the quality of that to make a bigger transition to betterness but... did you see what was wrong with that: it told you, it didn't show you. So, instead of something like that, try more along the lines of:
I wrote:
The open hatch let a cool and refreshing breeze blow through the rear compartment of the Pelican dropship - though, the Master Chief could not feel it through his green armor. The Spartan sat, barely leaning over the edge, in a seat adjacent to the open emerald sky. He gazed impassively at the smoking carcasses of buildings laying below him; his acute vision picking out friendly and enemy forces alike. The Marines were slowly being pushed back, herded through alleys and into delapedated structures by an ever pursuing enemy. John knew that those soldiers would need his help - if they were to make it through this fight alive.

Not all that much spicing up, but enough to give you a fair idea of what is going on. Hopefully, if this had been an actual story, I would have told you all the background and preping information you would need to make sense out of things. You would know already that the enemy was the Covenant, and how long ago they had begun their attack. Those are just a couple of the things you should think about when writing. Make a genuine effort to encompass everything.


And like Dave said: You can contact any of us to ask a question. We are here to help. Never forget that. Keep writing.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, about setting captions, I'd like you to remove them entirely. I'm trying to do that in my stories as well. I'm beginning to believe that setting captions aren't professional.

- Dave.
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"When in doubt, empty your magazine." - Murphy's first law of combat operations.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave Luck wrote:
Actually, about setting captions, I'd like you to remove them entirely. I'm trying to do that in my stories as well. I'm beginning to believe that setting captions aren't professional.

- Dave.


Why don't you explain for us? I'd like to hear your take on what exactly a "caption" is and where they should be used, or why they shouldn't be used at all.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captions are when you say this:

____This place, this time, this area, this blahdy-huh-blah, whatever.

And then the story goes here.

I'm removing them from the next installments of Master Chef's Bar and Grill. I don't really need them anyway, because I try to let my characters interact with the setting more - the captions are only mirroring Eric Nylund's style - although my WRITING style is COMPLETELY different from his. I tend to use implications more and avoid use of 'was.'

I'm against them, because they allow you to cheat at settings a little. Rather than imply your settings, they allow you to state everything up front - and thus take away from the story in general, because without captions, your characters need to relate and interact with your setting more.

With the captions, novices often fall into the trap of allowing the setting to become a backdrop - everything in the back becomes stagnant. Although I've used this as a tool to force my readers to focus on the characters for very short periods (I go to a writing club, remember, that's where the majority of my readers are!) if you're doing it unintentionally, that's not good. Setting is important.

- Dave.

With captions, details
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"Lizzie Borden took an axe and gave her mother forty whacks. When she saw what she had done, she gave her father forty-one." - A child's nursery rhyme.

"When in doubt, empty your magazine." - Murphy's first law of combat operations.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oops, I left an extra part there. I should finish it up.

With captions, details become less evident. That's why I usually want people to get rid of them. I usually add them as an afterthought - after I'm done typing the rest of the story - I put them in for fun. But people shouldn't rely on them to explain their setting.

- Dave.
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"Lizzie Borden took an axe and gave her mother forty whacks. When she saw what she had done, she gave her father forty-one." - A child's nursery rhyme.

"When in doubt, empty your magazine." - Murphy's first law of combat operations.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Captions are when you say this:

____This place, this time, this area, this blahdy-huh-blah, whatever.

And then the story goes here.

Ah. I tend to call those date/time and location headings. Now I have a new term! Smile

Quote:
I'm removing them from the next installments of Master Chef's Bar and Grill. I don't really need them anyway, because I try to let my characters interact with the setting more - the captions are only mirroring Eric Nylund's style - although my WRITING style is COMPLETELY different from his. I tend to use implications more and avoid use of 'was.'

I will agree that your writing style is nothing like Nylunds. I'd say your are a bit better, actually. But still different.
As for mirroring his style, I'd agree mostly. It depends on how you use them. For instance, Clancy, in some of his books, just uses a heading that says "Moscow" or "St. Petersburg", but nothing more than that. The ones used by Nylund and Dietz were pretty explanitory - telling the reader the time, date, and pinpointing the general location.

Quote:
I'm against them, because they allow you to cheat at settings a little. Rather than imply your settings, they allow you to state everything up front - and thus take away from the story in general, because without captions, your characters need to relate and interact with your setting more.

Well, I won'g agree with you 100% in this case. I think that, used properly, they can be a useful tool.
If done right, I don't think that they take all too much away from the setting. Because, while a setting does include location, it is about the location, not just where it is. With a heading, you still have all of your opportunity to describe what is around you. If I have a heading of "MCC's House" all that it tells you is that the scene will be around or in my house. It does not tell you what my house looks like, what my lawn looks like, what the city around my house looks like, what the car in my garage looks like, or anything. It just gives you a reference point.
Now, I think this can be helpful because: It can be helpful to remind a reader where you are with each transition without having to repeat it in your text every single time. After you have initially captured your surroundings, you no longer really need to say, at the start of each section in that place, "they continued to walk through the city of York". Then things start to get repedetive. It also helps if you have differing locations that could be confused. However, I do see one thing that could ail that: characters. If done right, the reader will begin to associate a location with a certain set of characters instead of a set of characters with a location - because if that were to happen, it could prove a hinderence when they move.
Now, onto the time aspect of things. I think that this also helps keep things in perspective. By giving the reader the time, you do not have to mention it in the text. And they get a good idea of how much time has elapsed. But, on the flip side of things, you could relay a time with the time of day, where the sun was, or including a subtle thing like "They had been walking all day, and the sun was beginning to set"; then it doesn't matter - 'cause you don't need specifics.
So, overall, I could go either way in an argument. I think that "captions" can serve a purpose without hurting a story. But, I also think that a story can be written just as good without captions. You've seen my opinions now.

[quote]With the captions, novices often fall into the trap of allowing the setting to become a backdrop - everything in the back becomes stagnant. Although I've used this as a tool to force my readers to focus on the characters for very short periods (I go to a writing club, remember, that's where the majority of my readers are!) if you're doing it unintentionally, that's not good. Setting is important.[/quote
I agree that the setting should always be alive - important or not in a story. It helps set the mood and keeps things in perspective. I know that I have read stories that, after an initial description, the setting kind of faded out - so the characters were acting on a blank stage. While it does allow you to put more focus on those characters, their interaction with the setting drops drastically, and then the story will, as you say, become stagnent. You can't easily continue a plot without keeping track of that which is around you.


That's my view on things. If there is something in this message that needs clearing up, please post here. But, for you Dave, or anyone else with a specific qualm, just PM me. I don't want to have clutter on a comments page.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry about those mistakes. This is a good example of what happens when you rush things: bad things. Oh well; I still, I think, got my point across - with or without the spelling and coding mistakes.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2005 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not that bad of a story here, its got some great potenital. you need to add in Detail in the story. You could also give a little background of the main character, not a life story though, just enough to wet the readers thoughts.

I will only say this once, paragraphs as well. You had some spelling and grammer mistakes as well. For the most part it flowed pretty well, with the exceptions of a couple of places that you left out the words.

I will try to follow this story. just keep in mind what your comments say about your story.
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